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  Topic Review (Newest First)
10-18-2012 12:37 PM
Lycon86 Ok I have been enlightened!

Think I'm going to stick to 95 ron! Unless i do some engine work! And change the compression. I might get the bike re dyno'd to see if the extra RONs make any difference

cheers guys
10-18-2012 11:24 AM
JusAnadaMexican site was found here:
http://www.btinternet.com/~madmole/R...RONMONPON.html
10-18-2012 11:23 AM
JusAnadaMexican this should help:

RON, MON or PON?

Or how do you grade petrol/gas

I have seen many European/US conversations claiming that one petrol/gas is better than another or higher rated. This may not be the case as different rating systems are used in different countries and so not all numbers mean the same thing. You must be careful to also quote the measurement system used

To see why there are different numbers let us take a trip back in time to World War I. Aviators had a problem, many engines would suddenly self destruct through detonation, which is bad news when you're up in the air. An engine might run fine on one batch of fuel but blow holes in the pistons on the next batch. The fuels seemed the same, weighed the same and may have even come from the same factory.

The fuel companies tried to analysis and standardise the petrol, but were unable to weed out the bad batches. Therefore a standard test engine with a variable compression facility was built and the fuel to be tested run through it. This heavy duty, single cylinder engine would be warmed to a standard temperature and at a set rpm the compression increased until engine knock occurred. this would give its Highest Usable Compression Ratio (HUCR).

But with time it was discovered that different labs gave different results. So in an attempt to produce an unvarying standard, two reference fuels were chosen. The high reference was 2-2-4 trimethylpentane (iso-octane), while the low reference was normal heptane (n-heptane). Once the HUCR was determined a mix of these to fuels was made up that exactly produced the same results as the HUCR test. The result is quoted as the percentage of iso-octane. Hence a petrol that detonated the same as a mix of 90% iso-octane and 10% n-heptane is called a 90 octane fuel.

Since that time a number of tests have come into being to simulate a variety of engine conditions. Motor Spirit is usually rated using the Research or Motor test methods. Both use the same old engine but under different conditions

Motor Octane Test (MON) Research Octane Test (RON)
Inlet air temperature 148.9 C 65.6 C
Engine jacket temp 100 C 100 C
Engine RPM 900 600
As you can see the Motor Octane Test employs a higher temperature and RPM and hence is probably a better indicator for today's engines. Of course the Research octane test gives a higher number and that's why the European manufacturers quote it (RON)

The spread between the two numbers is know as the fuels sensitivity, and it is very important. Because of the variety of engines it is possible for a petrol manufacturer to come up with a fuel that has a high RON, but a lower than expected MON. Hence although it looks normal on the pump it may perform badly. However on another day the same company may make its fuel out of a different blend to get the same RON but a different MON. This is done for profit reasons and is why you occasionally get bad fuel even though it is legally rated the same. In the past with high leaded fuels nobody noticed but nowadays high performance cars do notice (The Molemobile has just had a particularly bad batch from Total, and has been pinking all week)

In America the service stations use the Pump Octane Number or PON rather than RON. this is the average of RON and MON and gives a much better grade, and is also why the American gas always seems not as good as our when in fact it is is the same (and has better quality control). But even this system can be abused by adding octane boosters to poor fuel.

Below is an approximate comparison chart, these numbers can vary by as much as 2 grades

RON MON PON
90 83 86.6
92 85 88.5
95 87 91
96 88 92
98 90 94
100 91.5 95.8
105 95 100
110 99 104.5
So now you know far more you wanted to about RON, MON and PON. Knowing this you might begin to wonder why certain garages are always cheaper than others, and experiment with different fuels. I'm lucky, my new job has just given me a fuel card for private use, so I'm moving up to super unleaded, that way I can be assured I'm getting at least 95 RON
10-18-2012 11:21 AM
JusAnadaMexican these bikes suppose to take 91 PON, typically I like to use 90 MON, which ends up being 94 PON....you can get away with 87 MON and it'll be just fine, just be weary on which brands you use.
10-18-2012 11:15 AM
jondog9 I can only find 91 premium in CA. Since my bike is a CA (emmisions) bike, I'm assuming it's properly tuned for the 91.
Lycon86 - maybe you've seen this already, but I just found it.
http://www.rc51.org/fuel.htm
10-18-2012 10:08 AM
MakisRC51 Around here we have three gas options at the station

Superl LRP which is the one with the lead substances in it. Supposedly is 93 RON.
Unleaded 95 RON
Super Unleaded 100RON

When I bought the RC I was using the 100RON super unleaded which is very expensive. But since I rode the bike occasionally, I wouldn't mind the price. I really has the impression that the bike had better acceleration and more power.
Until one day on a trip, I had to refill but the gas station where I stopped didn't have Super unleaded. So I had to go with the 95RON unleaded.
In the next couple of hours riding, I discovered that the bike had exactly the same throttle response, less jumpy reactions to throttle's open/closes and the most important thing was that the engine temp was a couple degrees Celsius less on the clocks the whole trip back home.
I never used the 100RON again since.
When we upgraded my brother Blade's engine to full HRC settings, the 95RON wouldn't work so we went to 100RON. Now that is supercharged we still have the same issue. If we use a 95RON gas, the engine's rpm are limited to 7000...

Now I am considering to try the Super LRP out since I have removed the OEM slip ons with the catalysts in them and the RC doesn't have oxygen sensor to be damaged.

I would like to hear out your opinions on that.
10-18-2012 08:51 AM
RickyBobbyv8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycon86 View Post
We get 95 at the pump over here. And if you want 97 it costs a few extra pennies per litre. Race fuel is anything from 98 - 120 ron and cost a lot lot more.
There are very many different ways people rate gas octane ie: this is the gas we run in alot of our race cars.
C10 VP
• Motor Octane 96
• Research Octane: 104
• R+M/2: 100
I've done a little research and what i can find is that 97 ron is equivalent to our R+M/2: 93 which is what I've always ran in my bike for the lack of 91 in GA. If the 98 ron is the same as our 91 then it should be fine to use and maybe make a little more HP but not enough to notice.
10-18-2012 08:14 AM
Lycon86
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickyBobbyv8 View Post
Are you talkin about race gas? I've never seen 97 or 95 at the pump, not saying there ain't none, there just ain't none around here
We get 95 at the pump over here. And if you want 97 it costs a few extra pennies per litre. Race fuel is anything from 98 - 120 ron and cost a lot lot more.
10-18-2012 08:02 AM
RickyBobbyv8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycon86 View Post
Hey! Just had a thought. What fuel is everyone using? I know some bikes run fine on 97ron(higher octaine/ultimate) and others run better on the standard minimum 95. Just wondered if anyone has noticed any different.

Not sure if the SPs being fuel injected/Dynojetted makes any difference.

Dave
Are you talkin about race gas? I've never seen 97 or 95 at the pump, not saying there ain't none, there just ain't none around here
10-18-2012 03:27 AM
Lycon86
What fuel is everyone using?

Hey! Just had a thought. What fuel is everyone using? I know some bikes run fine on 97ron(higher octaine/ultimate) and others run better on the standard minimum 95. Just wondered if anyone has noticed any different.

Not sure if the SPs being fuel injected/Dynojetted makes any difference.

Dave

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