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Discussion Starter #1
Have just bought a tired 2002 SP2 from a friend. I'm now starting on a long road of TLC/restoration.

My first challenge is getting it to start.

I turn the key and the dash lights up - all good, but there's no sound from the fuel pump and it wont crank. I shorted out (on purpose!) the starter relay and the engine then cranks OK. So I know the battery and starter are OK.

The green neutral light is on, the kill-switch is set to run.

I've downloaded to the .pdf manual and am now starting to go through that. I've checked the 30A fuse - all good.

It has a power commander 3 fitted as well as an upmarket immobilizer that seems to disarm from the keyfob.

Your thoughts guys?
 

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when you toggle the kill switch does the Fi light come on for a few seconds, then go out?




if the bike won't crank (in neutral), check the fuse for the horn/tail light. that circuit runs the start button
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hi Wibbly,
Thanks for the super-prompt reply.
I've just checked, when I tried your test I thought I saw the FI light flicker very briefly, so I cycled the kill switch, it came on for a split second longer. I cycled it quite a few more times and then the fuel pump came on - so I'm presuming the kill switch is suffering from corrosion or worn?
After the fuel pump stopped priming, I tried the starter and the engine cranked over (yipee ;-) ), but didn't start. I pulled the 'choke' out and tried again, but nothing. It cranks but doesn't seem to fire at all.

Gavin.
 

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your kill switch is flaky.




is the ground on your power commander hooked up? the little ring terminal goes to battery NEGATIVE. if you hooked it up wrong or not at all you'll have no fuel.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Is the kill switch something i can remove and clean up? or the only option an new one?
I'll investigate the power commander wiring and report back.
 

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you can dismantle it and clean it. or jumper it out for now by connecting the black and black/white wires in the connector. then fix it once you're done testing.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
About 18" from the power commander box, a thin black wire comes out of the loom. This is connected to the black/-ve terminal on the battery.
 

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if the pc is hooked up correctly, the bike should start. jump the kill switch so the pump primes every time you key on, then try to start the bike with the high idle knob pulled.


if it won't fire, lift the tank and unhook the power commander and try again.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I guess the next step is to test for a spark? I've just opened the fuel tank and I can hear fuel in there when i rock the bike from side to side.
 

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do you smell fuel in the exhaust after cranking without firing? if you don't then it's likely a fuel issue. if you do then maybe it's time to look for spark. though i doubt it's a spark problem.

did you just park the bike and leave it? have you done anything to it?


it's also possible this immobilizer device you speak of is locking out the ignition. i'd be interested to know where it's connected. i'd bypass it if at all possible.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
There wasn't any smell of fuel after quite some cranking. Id guess there 3 to 4" of fuel in the tank.

The bike was running and then just parked up for 4+ years.

The immobilizer is a seriously integrated install - part of the UK insurance requirements. It will be possible to uninstall it, but it would involve a major rewire. Probably easier to get a new rear loom?
 

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the immobilizer likely taps into a single circuit. you'd be a fool to buy anything at this point.


if there's no fuel smell just unhook the power commander and try again.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Quick addition - I followed the wiring from the power commander under the tank - its not connected to anything! there are two round 1.5" connectors just by the side of the bottom of the tank. The original wiring looks to be connected OK.

I tried to start it again with the kill switch out of the equation - when I turn the ignition on, there is a single click from the back seat area, nothing else. Should I hear the pump prime each time? The last few times I've switched the ignition on, there's only been a relay click. I'm now unsure the pump is running/priming.
 

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ok look. you have to understand the sequence on these bikes.



the kill switch and bank angle sensor control the engine stop relay (also called bank angle sensor relay). this relay powers up the entire EFI system. this is the ECU, the fuel injectors, the ignition coils, and the fuel pump. the 30 amp fuse in the white fuse holder by the battery is the fuse for this entire system. the power wire goes straight to the BAS relay, but the BAS relay is controlled by a switched circuit (IGN in the fuse box).


when the ecu powers up, the FI light on the dash comes on for a few seconds. if the ecu wants the pump to prime, this is when it will happen.


the reasons the pump may not prime when the ecu is powered up would be any circuit trouble to do with the fuel system (failed loop check on a fuel injector etc)





if you have properly bypassed the kill switch, when you turn the ignition switch on, the FI light should come on (the click of the bank angle sensor relay should be heard) for a few seconds, and the pump should prime (fuel pump relay comes on with the BAS relay, then clicks off a few seconds later)




given you had this operation previously and have since lost it, i suspect you've messed something up. does the FI lamp light when you turn the key on? this indicates that the FI system is powered up. if it's not then you can look back to the post where i told you what to look for originally.
 

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@Greasemonkey - Yes, you should hear the fuel pump "whine" for a couple of seconds when you turn the key to the "on" position (the kill switch needs to be in the "run" position IIRC).

If you're not hearing the fuel pump prime, check over the items wibbly posted above. It might not hurt to post up a few pics or even a video to give us a better look at what you're experiencing as well (upload to youtube, etc).

G'luck troubleshooting !
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Hi Wibbly,

Sorry for the delay, I've been ill.

Ok, I've taken the kill switch apart, cleaned the contacts and it now appears 100%. Every time I turn on the ignition and hit the kill switch, the F1 light comes on etc.

Fresh gallon of fuel in.

So -> ignition switch off and kill switch off and bike in neutral -> then ignition on (gives Green neutral + oil pressure + yellow fuel + tach test + mileage and speed), then kill switch to run ( F1 light for a few seconds and a relay clicks), hit the starter, it cranks over.

No fuel pump noise at all at any point. No smell of fuel.

I've measured the voltage at the black 3 pin connector (like the manual says). I get 12v shortly after ignition on and kill switch to run (while fuel pump relay is on?). Then back to zero volts.

I've cleaned the black 3 pin connector connections.

I've visually inspected the wires from the black 3 pin connector to the pump - all look ok. I cant test for voltage at the pump itself as the connectors appear to be set in some kind of epoxy.

I'm thinking pump now, BUT it did work initially,.... All I've done in that area is lift the tank up at the front for a visual inspection.
 

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Hi Wibbly,

Sorry for the delay, I've been ill.

Ok, I've taken the kill switch apart, cleaned the contacts and it now appears 100%. Every time I turn on the ignition and hit the kill switch, the F1 light comes on etc.

Fresh gallon of fuel in.

So -> ignition switch off and kill switch off and bike in neutral -> then ignition on (gives Green neutral + oil pressure + yellow fuel + tach test + mileage and speed), then kill switch to run ( F1 light for a few seconds and a relay clicks), hit the starter, it cranks over.

No fuel pump noise at all at any point. No smell of fuel.

I've measured the voltage at the black 3 pin connector (like the manual says). I get 12v shortly after ignition on and kill switch to run (while fuel pump relay is on?). Then back to zero volts.

I've cleaned the black 3 pin connector connections.

I've visually inspected the wires from the black 3 pin connector to the pump - all look ok. I cant test for voltage at the pump itself as the connectors appear to be set in some kind of epoxy.

I'm thinking pump now, BUT it did work initially,.... All I've done in that area is lift the tank up at the front for a visual inspection.
Hi ,
I have recently bought a bike from a work mate ,—- same experience . The bike had been laid up for approx 2 years I found
1 a fuel tank full of crud and rust
2 a fuel pump completely ruined
I cleaned out the tank, replaced the fuel pump assembly but still no prime.
An auto electrician found a broken loom wire so I had prime but an engine that was uneven and cutting out.
Last step was to replace the fuel pressure regulator and now she runs like a Watch.

Lots of similar tales of woe on the net but it seems to me that if you a spark and a pump that primes a faulty Fpr is the most likely culprit , easily checked by disconnecting the vacuum line —-if fuel pees out the diaphragm is gone. This is an easy and cheap fix.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
So that saga continues,....

I got to the stage where (after servicing the kill switch) I was getting a reliable 12v at the 3pin connector half way along the left hand side of the frame. FYI, this voltage was only present for 2-3 seconds - quite normal.

So I concluded the pump was duff. This seemed very odd as I had heard it running a few weeks before,...

Anyway, I ordered a new pump. This arrived a couple of days later. As a test, I plugged it into the 3-way black connector where I had previously got 12v. Nothing,...

Could both pumps be duff - very unlikely,....

So I connected the new pump to a 12v battery,...nothing,...so sent it back. Ordered another from a different source. Cheap Chinese kit? Who knows.

The new pump arrived a day or so later and I again connected it to the 12v Supply - SUCCESS !!!

So I took the old pump out of the tank (euwww what a disgusting mess) and cleaned what I could.

While the tank was off, I decided to touch-up some of the paint work.

When it's dry in the morning, I'll refit the tank, put some fuel in and see what happens,...
 
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